I agree with you both on this issue!!!
The Universe is endlessly fascinating. I have just ploughed myself through three major works on the new physics (quantum physics, the new vacuum energy research including the Higgs field and the Higgs boson, and a book on how INDETERMINISTIC and thereby OPEN The Universe fundamentally is).
I can only say one thing: The absolutely magical place we call The Universe leaves me in total awe!!! How can I do anything but worship and celebrate this amazing thing???
I believe this was Zarathushtra's PATHOS too and his sole obsession in life was how we could collaborate as human beings to liberate each other and bring out the best of creativity out of each other. Indeed, this is good thoughts, good words, good deeds, for THEIR OWN SAKE, for our love of existence, and in that order too. For us to manifest Ahura Mazda, to give BODY to asha!
Modern physics only makes me a STRONGER and more convinced Zoroastrian!!! I certainly don't think followers of other religions feel the same way. We really should declare CERN in Switzerland as a Zoroastrian temple, Zarathushtra would agree totally!
Brotherly love
Alexander
2009/12/9 Special Kain
Dear Fariborz,
But if that's everything as in «100% everything» and not only cultural artefacts, the entire universe was someone's (undeniably great) idea who would then build it out of nowhere. Science tells completely different stories that are far more exciting and fascinating.
When I hear religionists talk about a secular scientist's world view, they always seem to pity him, since «his» disentchanted universe must be a helplessly lonely and depressing universe. But that's just total bullshit: if you listen to the story of cosmology and astrophysics, it's a most fascinating story and truly inspiring! The scientific story is far more exciting and overwhelming than any religionist's creationistic gibberish. There's definitely some beauty to modern physics and chemistry that's most enjoyable!
If Zarathushtra was a little more «psychological», then he was totally right: the thoughts we think this morning will determine what we will say and do in the afternoon. So it's better to start the day with a constructive attitude, since what we do will unquestionably shape the world we live in. In this sense the Zoroastrian story about the origin and creation of our world is rather ethical than cosmological.
Ushta, Dino
--- Fariborz Rahnamoon
Von: Fariborz Rahnamoon
Betreff: Re: [Ushta] The birth of our universe, the creation of life
An: Ushta@yahoogroups.com
Datum: Mittwoch, 9. Dezember 2009, 6:39
Dear Dino
You are most probably referring to Gatha Yasna 28.11 when you say "Zarathustra repeatedly asks Ahura, Mazda, Asha and others how the universe came into being," my question is Did Ahura Mazda ever reply and give him the answer?
Such translations are influenced by the Greek standards of an anthropomorphic God . Zarathustra in the Gathas mentions "Ahura Mazda" only 8 times. I have explained it in this article Please click to read.
http://ahura. homestead. com/files/ IranZaminSixteen /GATHAS_OF_ ZARATHUSHTRA_ 16_FARIBORZ. mht
What I read in 28.11 is in fact what we so proudly announce as our main principle GOOD THOUGHTS GOOD WORDS GOOD DEEDS while being told how CREATION COMES INTO BEING. Of course he is concerned with the creation On Earth and not the creation Of the Earth,
A free translation of 28.11 will read as follows
Every thing that is created was first a Thought.
So let your Thoughts be Good
Good Thoughts are those that are in harmony with the Wisdom in Creation
Let your Good Thoughts be know through Good Words
For that's when Creation first comes into being
ZARATHUSHTRA - GATHA - YASNA HA. 28.11 (FR)
Therefore
GOOD THOUGHTS - GOOD WORDS - GOOD DEEDS
With Regards & Best Wishes
Fariborz Rahnamoon
http://www.ancienti ran.com
http://www.wzccbc. com
--- On Tue, 12/8/09, Special Kain
From: Special Kain
Subject: [Ushta] The birth of our universe, the creation of life
To: Ushta@yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, December 8, 2009, 1:51 PM
Dear friends,
I've just seen a wonderful and fascinating documentary about the creation of life and our universe: from the Big Bang to our ancestors 40'000 years ago. The second documentary was about Christianity, Judaism and Islam and their views about evolution and the creation of the universe. They all agree that God simply appeared in a world that was outrageously chaotic, so he started to analytically seperate some things that had already existed and creatively invent brand new things, such as human beings.
It's most important to note that there's no talk about such matters in the Gathas. The world is there already, and it's a world that constantly changes. Zarathushtra repeatedly asks Ahura, Mazda, Asha and others how the universe came into being, how things work, what's the cause and what's the effect, since the whole universe is based on this terrifically simple principle of cause and effect.
I see such religious theories as stories that are competing with each other and compose the elements of future stories. To stop arbitrarily and claim that one of all these stories was the only true story and all future stories were necessarily incorrect would be super-overhasty.
My two cents after watching TV,
Dino
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